Smf 2.1 a beauty

Doug Heffernan

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Feb 28, 2018
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156
Hello,

Have you guys seen Smf 2.1.? It is simply a beauty imo. It has a cool default theme and it has a lot of nice features that the paid forums have. Imo it is even better than xenforo or Ipb. I am a little surprised that it has not received the attention that it deserves.
 

Pete

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It's also 6 years in the making and every change in recent months seems to need multiple subsequent fixes, with no apparent plan of where it's going.

It's gotten to the point where I refuse to pull the fixes in from upstream to my fork, I'd rather fix things myself.

Also, that theme is an utter pain to customise, where I spent so much time ripping out all the many gradients.

Also, also, after I had yet another argument with Suki, it was clear that me finding and reporting bugs wasn't welcome since I clearly seem to do more testing than the entire SMF dev community at times.
 

zappaDPJ

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Aug 26, 2010
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Hello,

Have you guys seen Smf 2.1.? It is simply a beauty imo. It has a cool default theme and it has a lot of nice features that the paid forums have. Imo it is even better than xenforo or Ipb. I am a little surprised that it has not received the attention that it deserves.
I have it running on a test server. I thought wrongly that it was close to release when I first installed it two years ago. I've given up applying updates so I'm running a version that's probably around 6 months old but I'm starting to suspect the human race will colonise Mars long before 2.1 gets released.

I agree with Pete the theme is a real pain to customise and that's one reason why I doubt we'll ever upgrade to it. If there's going to be that much work involved I might as well look for the best solution and I really don't think 2.1 will be it.

I'm also a little concerned about the dynamics within the development team. If it's bad in the public domain you can bet your life it's a whole lot worse behind close doors.

But anyway, enough of that, welcome to TAZ ips_doug :)
 

Pete

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There's been at least three completely different groups of people called the dev team throughout the last six years. At one point i was on one of them.

Then I had a multipage argument about changing "child boards" to "sub boards" and realised it was mostly in trouble and didn't want to try to fix that particular mess.

Then after 2.0.14 and how badly that went down, I snapped and forked StoryBB rather than building SMF plus mods for the site I'm trying to get launched.

I should point out, I took Peacock - one of the last DzinerStudio themes - and ported it to 2.1. Doing that was an utter nightmare. Literally taking a WP theme and applying to 2.0 was easier.
 

XinYenFon

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Jun 7, 2012
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152
I'm quiet curious related the theme related difficulties you guys facing/having, do note; I'm no longer active developer of SMF so I'm only asking for conversation.
 

Doug Heffernan

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Feb 28, 2018
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Thank you all for your replies guys. I was not aware that it took so long to develop the 2.1. version. That and what Pete says about the behind the scene situation within the development team is very worrisome.

I have not looked into changing the theme yet. I have taken a look more in the developement area and it is pretty easy to develop for Smf 2. I think I will stick with Smf for a while, it has a lot of good mods and a helpful community.

If my forum will take off and things will not improve with smf I will look into some of the paid forums.

zappaDPJ , thank you for your welcome.
 

lurkalot

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I hoped the theme stuff would be easier to work with in 2.1, but to me it's more complicated than ever.
 

Pete

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I'm quiet curious related the theme related difficulties you guys facing/having, do note; I'm no longer active developer of SMF so I'm only asking for conversation.
So so so many gradients. Gradients and shadows everywhere. If implementing a flat theme, it's an utter nightmare. I have, somewhere, a copy of Peacock that I ported from 2.0 to 2.1, and I kept all its CSS separate so it's just applied as additional CSS on top of the current SMF skin for ease of maintenance, and so much of it is simply about undoing gradients and shadows.

Other challenges: some of the responsive styling makes it hard to make other changes, e.g. the mobile stuff done to the board index makes it really hard to add additional things in there. I wanted to port Tidy Child Boards and gave up trying to wrangle the code to cope with it. Also in my case I want to put little indicators next to each of the boards (but not in place of the board icons), e.g. 'In Character board' - but this is borderline impossible to do nicely in the current styling.

Also sometime I really need to figure out how to redo the alerts menu, the sizing being based off 480px width really doesn't work for me given that I have 4 things in that top area, not the 3 that come with SMF, but that's my doing.

I hoped the theme stuff would be easier to work with in 2.1, but to me it's more complicated than ever.
It absolutely is more complicated than ever. While Curve had its faults (namely implementing things with massive images), I found it easier to work on Curve than I do on Curve 2.

a helpful community
For some definition of helpful. There's not so many people left that really know the innards well any more, and so many people who fob off with non-help answers.
 

XinYenFon

Developer
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152
So so so many gradients. Gradients and shadows everywhere. If implementing a flat theme, it's an utter nightmare. I have, somewhere, a copy of Peacock that I ported from 2.0 to 2.1, and I kept all its CSS separate so it's just applied as additional CSS on top of the current SMF skin for ease of maintenance, and so much of it is simply about undoing gradients and shadows.
I introduced more gradients but it was discussed with the team none seems find it wrong so :p never got into shadows those are from Alpha (Git) builds so I'll pass on that.

Other challenges: some of the responsive styling makes it hard to make other changes, e.g. the mobile stuff done to the board index makes it really hard to add additional things in there. I wanted to port Tidy Child Boards and gave up trying to wrangle the code to cope with it. Also in my case I want to put little indicators next to each of the boards (but not in place of the board icons), e.g. 'In Character board' - but this is borderline impossible to do nicely in the current styling.
Gimme the broken version of what you want I'll fix it for you (or at least I'll see my error in the ways of doing).
 

Elf_Ears

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Aug 10, 2017
Messages
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Yeah. As Pete said it's kinda a ****show (If one I'm prepared to wait through)
Although I totally disagree on the theme front (non flat master race)

Not sure exactly sure what happened with 2.0.14 though. It's probably over the rediculous amount of time to add php7 support and image proxy support..
(Feature lock is the absolute god of the SMF team. It's usually a huge hinderance)
 

Elf_Ears

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Ooh! Nearly forgot!
Despite all the improvements for mobile afaik they still haven't changed that horrible tiny hard to edit themewise page index.

Although credit to them, when I brought this up they all accepted the problem 100 percent and said they'd be changing it closer to release.

Now I know this could all fall by the wayside but if they keep their promise consider this post rescinded
 

Pete

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It's probably over the rediculous amount of time to add php7 support and image proxy support..
It's the utter lack of testing and the methodology used to try to solve PHP 7. There are ways to solve PHP 7 without bumping the minimum version of PHP required, and without the problems they had.

The lack of planning regarding the login box didn't help them out either (again, lack of testing, since maybe they might have noticed that they'd broken SSI login with it)

And there's still multiple bugs in the proxy, again through lack of testing.

afaik they still haven't changed that horrible tiny hard to edit themewise page index.
This can be changed somewhat in the theme now.
 

Pete

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That's likely because the published stable version has been around for six years, and the new version with a new theme is stuck in development hell.
 

radu81

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Feb 17, 2012
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SMF2.0 was my favourite forum software, I used it from 2007 to 2014 then I switched 1 forum to xenforo and 2forums to elkarte, an smf fork. What 2 developers did in 3-4 years with elkarte the smf team was not able to do in 10 years. No offense for smf team but you really need to change something and release the 2.1 stable, NOW, not "when is ready".
 

Bigguy

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Sep 25, 2005
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It's my favorite. I'm currently using SMF 2.1 Beta 4. They are getting close to an RC release as far as I can tell from Github. It has taken far to long though. Hopefully we won't have to wait much longer.
 

Pete

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You mean, you're using some unspecified version in the last few months that literally no one knows exactly where it's at, because you still don't make a note of what GitHub release you took, making it harder for everyone to help you debug problems.

Are they still adding features and major changes without testing them? I stopped looking after being so disgusted that they're still redoing things that are improvements, not bug fixes, meaning that actually dragging it over the line will take ever longer. I even gave up trying to keep track of bug fixes, because every bug fix would require subsequent fixes due to lack of testing.

So glad I forked and gave up worrying about upstream, made it so much easier to have a code base I could actually trust.
 

Bigguy

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They are doing testing. I'm not sure how much though. I keep a watch on github for some reason. It's like watchin someone take two steps forward and three back, lol.
 

Pete

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They are doing testing. I'm not sure how much though. I keep a watch on github for some reason. It's like watchin someone take two steps forward and three back, lol.
That's exactly my point. I just got to the point of being sick of it.
 
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