Invision power services is pulling a fast one on their customers

[Michael_]

Pay more get less.
Thats IPS new business model since version 4.5.

Some of you probably already know but i have not been using IPS for quite some time.

Well i decided to start a new website in 2021 and found that IPS is the best software for the job.
Xenforo is also very nice but for this specific project IPS simply better fits my needs.
Main reason is that it has better plugins for this specific site which means i save a ton on custom work.

But this comes at a price!

I did NOT knew that they invented that "marketplace" feature which is basically an "app store" with version 4.5.
This means in your ACP you browse the store to find plugins, than klick "buy" (if it is a paid plugin), than click "install". Just like a fool.
It exactly works like the app store on your smartphone.

While this is a nice feature for basic users they do not let you download the plugins anymore.
They install it in the background and remove the installation package after the install has been completed. You never get to see the full package.

So basically your spending couple hundreds or on large sites maybe even thousands of $ and wont even get the installation packages of your plugins.
If you decide to reinstall your software and / or plugins a few years down the line:
Well, too bad. How about you buying the fancy new version of our software and plugins?

I think thats outrageous!
To add insult to injury: Today almost every plugin costs like 15$ or more. So thats an expensive problem too.
Gone by have the days where you could download 90% of the plugins for free. (Or in this case even download them at all!)

Well thankfully we live in a capitalist society which means customers and their money decide which companys and products survive.
In the future i would definitely spend my money on xenforo (if it works for the project) rather than supporting these scumbags over at invision power services.

 

[Jeremy8]

What is the benefit of being able to download them exactly? I imagine admins with less experience might prefer doing it the way you explained.

Gone by have the days where you could download 90% of the plugins for free

The same is true for XF. A lot of the development community came from vB, and vB 3/4 had a lot of free add-ons, which isn't really the case for XF.

 

[Michael_]

What is the benefit of being able to download them exactly? I imagine admins with less experience might prefer doing it the way you explained.

If you see IPS as an (expensive) "use and throw away" product there is nothing wrong with that.
But having the complete source code actually eliminates this problem:

If you decide to reinstall your software and / or plugins a few years down the line:
Well, too bad. How about you buying the fancy new version of our software and plugins?

 

[borbole]

Pay more get less.
Thats IPS new business model since version 4.5.

Some of you probably already know but i have not been using IPS for quite some time.

Well i decided to start a new website in 2021 and found that IPS is the best software for the job.
Xenforo is also very nice but for this specific project IPS simply better fits my needs.
Main reason is that it has better plugins for this specific site which means i save a ton on custom work.

But this comes at a price!

I did NOT knew that they invented that "marketplace" feature which is basically an "app store" with version 4.5.
This means in your ACP you browse the store to find plugins, than klick "buy" (if it is a paid plugin), than click "install". Just like a fool.
It exactly works like the app store on your smartphone.

While this is a nice feature for basic users they do not let you download the plugins anymore.
They install it in the background and remove the installation package after the install has been completed. You never get to see the full package.

So basically your spending couple hundreds or on large sites maybe even thousands of $ and wont even get the installation packages of your plugins.
If you decide to reinstall your software and / or plugins a few years down the line:
Well, too bad. How about you buying the fancy new version of our software and plugins?

I think thats outrageous!
To add insult to injury: Today almost every plugin costs like 15$ or more. So thats an expensive problem too.
Gone by have the days where you could download 90% of the plugins for free. (Or in this case even download them at all!)

Well thankfully we live in a capitalist society which means customers and their money decide which companys and products survive.
In the future i would definitely spend my money on xenforo (if it works for the project) rather than supporting these scumbags over at invision power services.

The reason that you got so upset imo is that one won''t be able to ripp off other people hard work. I strongly suspect that you are this user who is complaining about this at one of the most notorious nulled forums:

http://invision-virus.com/forum/ind...system-looking-for-45-marketplace-workaround/

You post there is almost identical to the one you started at the ipb forum, and round the same time too.

Regarding the part about free plugins, I would say the opposite. Gone are the days of freeloading. If you think that you will find free plugins only at xf, you will be in for a big surprise.

At least you know that with Ipb you will get quality and safe plugins, whereas at xf is download and use at your own risk.

Better yet, why don't you stop moaning and start learning to code and develop your own plugins?

So, if there is any scambag here, it is you.

 

[Michael_]

The reason that you got so upset imo is that one won''t be able to ripp off other people hard work. I strongly suspect that you are this user who is complaining about this at one of the most notorious nulled forums:

http://invision-virus.com/forum/ind...system-looking-for-45-marketplace-workaround/

You post there is almost identical to the one you started at the ipb forum, and round the same time too.

Regarding the part about free plugins, I would say the opposite. Gone are the days of freeloading. If you think that you will find free plugins only at xf, you will be in for a big surprise.

At least you know that with Ipb you will get quality and safe plugins, whereas at xf is download and use at your own risk.

Better yet, why don't you stop moaning and start learning to code and develop your own plugins?

So, if there is any scambag here, it is you.

Boy i've just spent 1500 bucks on IPS and plugins. So im definitely not the "scambag" you suspect me to be.

 

[zappaDPJ]

Whether valid or not, criticism of a product or a company's trading practices is accepted here but referring to the developers as 'scumbags' is pushing boundaries that will likely cause this thread to be locked or even deleted.

For reference; it's also worth mentioning that this has been discussed at length in other recent threads below this one with considerable input from the developer.

 

[kolakube]

Spending $1,500 for a highly functional and connected do-it-yourself community platform sounds like a bargain to be honest.

 

[Joel R]

This was posted June 2020: https://invisioncommunity.com/news/product-updates/45-one-more-thing-r1204/

For any prospective customers, if you're the kind of customer who wants to cross-install your plugins on multiple sites even though it's generally a violation of licensing agreements and cross-share with nulled piracy sites which is most definitely a violation of licensing agreements, then IPS is probably not the right ecosystem for you. Just wanted to put that out there.

I'm sure there are other ecosystems that support and condone such behavior.

 

[Alpha1]

Has there been a decrease in nulled software for IPS since this change took effect? Does this approach really work?
Or are new addon releases since IPS 4.5 still available on nulled websites?
It would be great if its effective.

 

[Michael_]

Spending $1,500 for a highly functional and connected do-it-yourself community platform sounds like a bargain to be honest.

In the short run, yes.
But you need to keep paying and paying and paying like there's no tomorrow. *
Kinda like a blackmailer.

So its not in the long run.

* You can still run your existing website when you stop paying. But you will loose access to your bought products if you dont renew / pay for updates again.

 

[Michael_]

Happy new year

 

[zappaDPJ]

In the short run, yes.
But you need to keep paying and paying and paying like there's no tomorrow. *
Kinda like a blackmailer.

So its not in the long run.

* You can still run your existing website when you stop paying. But you will loose access to your bought products if you dont renew / pay for updates again.

For a single payment with no renewal costs you could of course migrate your forum to vBulletin 5

 

[Michael_]

Well there is nothing wrong with paying for updates.

But i think there is something wrong with losing access to the (old) version of products you bought when your not willing to pay again for new versions and updates.
And i also think there is something wrong with not getting the FULL source code of plugins you buy.

In 2 words: Planned obsolescense.

But i think i made my point clear enough so far.
So now everybody can decide on their own what to like, buy and use.

 

[Bionic Rooster]

Well there is nothing wrong with paying for updates.

But i think there is something wrong with losing access to the (old) version of products you bought when your not willing to pay again for new versions and updates.
And i also think there is something wrong with not getting the FULL source code of plugins you buy.

In 2 words: Planned obsolescense.

But i think i made my point clear enough so far.
So now everybody can decide on their own what to like, buy and use.

Michael_ Thanks for posting this as it is a train of thought I had not considered while looking into buying an Invision license. I personally prefer to download any source code I purchase as it is tangible and can be used any time or anywhere within the limits of license agreements.
It's nice to see peoples ideas and points of views as it gives clarity to making the final decision on any purchase.
Thanks again for your input

 

[Alpha1]

I really like to have the files as well, because that makes it much easier for other developers to understand and modify. But if not providing source code proves to be an effective method against piracy then that is indirectly a significant benefit to customers. Because if developer work is protected and results in higher income for the developer then that will ultimately result in more addons and more effort in those addons. Which would be an appealing factor in my book.

 

[Paul M]

Regardless of how you install it, surely the actual code must still be on your server (and hence viewable) - how else can it run ?

 

[Michael_]

Regardless of how you install it, surely the actual code must still be on your server (and hence viewable) - how else can it run ?

They delete the part thats necessary to install an addon after its installed. (The installation package containing the install routine)
The part needed to run it is still there of course.

 

[Paul M]

They delete the part thats necessary to install an addon after its installed.

Thats not really that important I would have thought, but a few permission changes would likely prevent that.

The part needed to run it is still there of course.

Exactly, so you still have access to the actual addon code, which is the important part.

 

[Michael_]

Thats not really that important I would have thought

Except you want to reinstall your software a few years down the line.

 

[Oh!]

Except you want to reinstall your software a few years down the line.

Please forgive my ignorance. But is there is no option to reinstall the add-on for the same domain (within the terms/limits - I'm thinking mostly of time limits - for the specific add-on)? If the purpose of the limitation (removal of the installation package) is to help protect against piracy, there surely is little added risk by allowing reinstalls of the same add-on to the same domain.